I could see an advantage with a timed game for a tournament. I could also see an advantage for keeping games going. For example, I like 1 day phases to allow for real life to get in the way. But don't really like to have them take a full 24 hours. I would much prefer to see 2-3 phases per day on a +-7 player game, more if playing 1v1.

However, I think I would not enjoy timed games that have too short of a time frame. I don't like the pressure.

As for the Vdip official time, I don't really see it being necessary. I think people will still say "I'll get back to you tomorrow". On the other hand, I can see how it might have been useful in something like the Bourse, where there is moderation outside of a game.

I think Guaroz is asking for a clock counter as part of the vDip homepage, rather than a clock that resets itself according to you location.

Personally I think it would be a handy addition.

Well yes: the "Official Clock" on your HP wouldn't be a revolution. Just a handy addition, like kaner says.... It would worth the effort only if it was easy to implement. I proposed it because I think it is, but I'm not a programmer.

Devo, I believe that almost nobody likes to have pressure. But it could be nice to try, knowing that the other player would have the same pressure.
It would be optional and you could choose "how much pressure". So if you usually end your 1v1s in, say, 8 days then "TT=8days" would be basically no pressure, because you'd have surely more time avaliable then you usually spend. Instead "TT=8days" would be some pressure if you usually end your 1v1s in 16 days. You couldn't afford to save your orders midphase and "let the phase go to the deadline" each phase, because you'd just waste many hours of your TT.

That's why it would be useful any time you need to end a game within a certain days:
-a- "Devo, like to play a 24h/ph semi-live?" "Yes, but I'll leave in 10 days. Please let it be a REAL semi-live!" "No prob, let's set TT=5 days!"
-b- Imagine a 1v1 with 10days/phase and TT=10 days. No deadlines. No NMRs. No extensions requests. Only your TT to deal with. Wouldn't it be funny?
-c- Tournaments. You need to have all games finished in, say, 20 days. What do you do? Say to players who log in only once a day "Please don't sign up"? Say them "Please always finalize"? If you put TT=10 you'd be sure all games would end up in max 20 days. Incredibly slow players would surely remember to finalize. And maybe to check their tournament games more often or BEFORE their non-tournament games.

Kaner, sorry. I answered his 2 questions in reverse order. My last paragraph was regarding a clock on the homepage. Basically I thought it could have some usefulness, but not really necessary.

This is a great idea, both of them.

It would be nice to find out if the time one regarding tournaments is possible. Since that would be really useful for the second vDip Cup.

I just reread this thread and I think I was not very clear about the TT proposal. Let me do a second attempt.

- - -

The timing in 1v1 is phase-based now. Both players have the same time avaliable FOR EACH PHASE to think and put their orders in. If you waste your time and don't save any order, this will make all your units hold and this will bring you to a defeat (unless your opponent really sucks!).

My proposal is basically to give (as an option) both players the same time avaliable FOR THE WHOLE GAME. You'd have your personal clock saying how much time you got left. When you finalize you stop your contdown on your clock, and it would restart if you un-finalize to make some changes or if a new phase starts. If you got no time left, you lose the game.

I called this global time "TT" (Thinking Time) and I said that we could express it in days. Actually in hours would be better.

The kind of variant I'm interested in, would be when you choose a long phase lenght like 10 days. Or even infinite, if it would be possible.

The first advantage would be that you wouldn't be pressed if that phase you don't have the time, because you'd have more time to manage.
The second, is that you could make a game whose you know exactly the maximum real-time lenght.

Let's see some example.

1. TT = 2 hrs, phase = 10 days or ∞
This is a LIVE-GAME. It won't last more than 4 hours under any circumstance, unless players decide to pause it.
One more advantage on putting phase = 5 or 10 min, is that sometimes you need more time to think or to put all your orders, expecially at the end of the game when you got a lot of units to be ordered.
You only got to wisely manage your time. Saving orders make sense only if you need to re-check them.

2. Have you ever agreed to play a semi-live with somebody? I did often. The agreement you do with another often-online-player is basically to have a 24 or 36 hrs/phase, but when you're both online you play it as if it was a live.
So the game is intended to last a few days but for some reason, after I make a good turn and I take advantage, my opponent starts to SAVE his orders and let the whole phase go. If you ask, he's claiming to be having a very busy week. He's probably hoping that I'll miss some turn.
Well, I do not miss turns, but the "Semi-Live" we agreed is now lasting a month or more. Grrrr. :(
With this feature, you could just set:
TT = 5 days, phase = 10 days or ∞
No way the game can last more than 10 days. This is the real SEMI-LIVE.

3. TT = 12 days, phase = 10 days or ∞
This would be a regular, maybe a bit fast, 1v1.
You could even think 3 or 4 days long on a crucial turn, if you spent your time wisely before it. Because the pressure the time puts on you is for the whole game, not for a single phase.
And if for some reason some RL issue keeps you away from your PC say... 8 hours and you didn't even got the chance to ask for a pause or extend, then:
- with TT = 12 days, you only lose 8 of your 240 hours;
- without it, if in those 8 hours there was the deadline and you didn't save anything yet, then you NMR, your units all hold, and you've basically lost the game.

- - -

So, aside the fact that it'd be fantastic for the starting tournament, wouldn't "TT" be a nice 1v1 Variant?

What do all the 1v1-lovers say?

I like the TT option.
Summarizing, Guaroz correct me if I am wrong, my TT is the time I'm playing the 1vs1 game when my orders are NOT finalized.
Since my TT might run when I'm sleeping I feel like 12 days is a bit low, but the evidence of fact might prove this is just a wrong sensation

As said earlier it depends how long a game would normally take you. If you normally take 14 days to finish a game then 12 wouldn't be so difficult but if it normally takes you 20 then it would be more of a challenge.

Well yes, experience will teach to all of us which is the good TT lenght for each one.
As well as I know that 15min phase is too fast for me and that's why I don't play live games. But someone do.
Or also, I really don't like 5days/phase games because they're too slow for my taste, nonetheless sometimes those kind of games find enough joiners.
Taste! Yes, I believe that in the end it'll be just a matter of taste.

And a matter of what your RL is.
DL: "Since my TT might run when I'm sleeping I feel like 12 days is a bit low"
You know...It depends on what you do when you're awake.
If you log in and finalize 5 times a day, when the game will be finished you may still have 150 hours left. But if you log in only once every 3 days, you may not see the 3rd year of the game.

And afer all, looking at all NMRs around now, there's a lot of players who don't know how to choose the right phase lenght for themselves. So I guess that even with experience, there will be always someone who mistakes the right TT lenght for himself.

Recap. It will be a matter of
- personal experience
- personal taste
- personal "log-in-the-site" pace
- personal smartness !!
the same things you use when you choose a phase lenght. ;-)